Moses O
You are God sent! I found your blog last night while I was googling dentist torture. I need your help and advise.
Yesterday while I was at work my mother took my son to the dentist (Kids Dental Place on Indian School Road, Phoenix, AZ 85016) He had NINE root canals, not to mention crowns and other unnecessary work that was preformed.
His face and lips are swollen and he is all bruised up inside and outside his mouth. He also has scratches on his arms and imprints on his arm from where they strapped him down.
I had NO IDEA that no parents are allowed in the back or else I wouldn't have brought him there! My mother thought she was coming in for a couple of fillings turned into NINE root canals. I am so horrified.
Can you give me some wisdom or guidance on what to do?I asked Moses’ mom if she could send me any pictures of his injuries and asked if she had gotten his charts from Kids Dental Place.
I spoke to the office manager and she was basically like "who cares" and he does Nine root canals all the time, like it is no big deal!!! This is so unacceptable, who sits and get nine root canals in one sitting?? My poor baby.
My son also told me that they did not give him any pain medication that he as crying the whole time! And that the densest was very mean! My son does not lie either and is a vey smart boy for his age (4).
Thanks a million!
She sent me photos as well as a copy of his chart with permission to show them to anyone I felt comfortable with for a review.
By Friday morning, I got this:
He woke up 4 times screaming. At one point he didn't even want me only his grandma.Over the next several days Moses’ mom and I emailed each other many times. She told me Moses was not sleeping, would not let anyone hold him except his nana and certainly would not let anyone near his mouth. Moses’ mom called the police and they refused to even take her complaint.
I tried to make a police report and they refused they said I needed to contact the BBB and medical board. What do I do?
I have bad news about the pictures, when my mother was trying to download she erased them and I wasn't able to recover. The ones I have are on my phone I have like 10 of them but like I said the quality does not do us any justice.
Monday August 15, 2011:
I got his records the day I spoke to the Office Admin Rebecca. I do not think he even needed all that work done by the look of his x-rays.
I can send you them and the paper work that I got. His dad was the one who took him to that place initially. He was the one who signed off on all that work back in April, but I never received a copy of the paperwork.
He just told me that he needed a couple of fillings. When my mother called for an appointment they told her the same thing just a "couple of filings".
I have been so depressed and helpless, seems nobody wants to help me! I just want to go and wait for him at his office and cuss him out and do what he did to my baby! It hurts me so much.
I shot off complaint after complaint so now it's just a waiting game. Do u know roughly how long it takes to get progress? Or what I should expect?Tuesday August 16, 2011- Moses’ condition takes a down turn:
Thanks again for all ur help
Hi Deb,
My Moses is not doing good he now has a fever of 102 since 6:30am. My mother and I took him to the Phoenix Children's Hospital ER department and they did not do anything. They wanted to strap him down to look in his mouth & I refused.Early Tuesday evening, August 16, 2011:
I explained what happened to him & they could not careless. I do not know what is going on with these doctors! This is horrible.
The doctor just refused to help & so we left! He said there is nothing he can do since my son won't open his mouth. I am so frustrated you have no idea! The doctor literally walked out on me & told me to go back to the dentist! Who the heck does that?!?!
I just got out of his pediatrician office all he did was look in his mouth & see the inflammation & drooling and he already knew. He even called the hospital and asked what happened & gave them a piece of his mind!Wednesday August 17, 2011:
He said those young residents don't know what they are doing & should never put a child thru that! His fever was 104!!! He prescribed him antibiotics for the infection. Let's hope that helps. If not he might need an IV. I feel so helpless again!
I was reviewing the paperwork and all the documents that the Office administrator gave me and I noticed that he submitted for 11 root canals but on the billing ledger he has 13!!
They initially told me he had 9 done, but I am thinking that he had THIRTEEN!! My poor baby! Who does 13 root canals on a 4 year old?
This is insurance fraud?!?!
I will scan in the documents and let you take a look. You have my permission to show them to whoever.
Dentist 1 review of Moses’ charts
1. Only a parent or legal guardian can give Informed Consent for medical or dental treatment. The potential Defendant will argue, the parent did in fact sign Informed Consent for treatment. However, the child's dental health status was very different @ initial exam, when form was signed, until several months later, when care was delivered. Unless the grandmother was a legal guardian, the Defendant will have issues to address.Friday August 26, 2011- Nana’s trying hard to help
2. The quality of the dental treatment was highly suspect, e.g. open
margins on crowns.
3. The x-rays do NOT support the need for all the care given. Defendant may argue, that patient had a serious caries problem, & crowns verses option of direct fillings was preemptive. Unfortunately for Defendant, the quality of the fit of many of the crowns is inferior & virtually guarantees addition future caries. Further, why all the seemingly unneeded pulpotomies (baby root canals)? Again, is this "preemptive" for the iatrogenic (disease or infection caused by doctor's care) treatment of the doctor.
4. The Medicaid forms have no date for treatment, so I assume these are "Pre-Authorizations". This demonstrates a broken system. All this care should NEVER have been pre-approved by Medicaid, based on the radiographs.
However, since Medicaid did approve the treatment plan, who's to argue?
Unfortunately for doctor, I seriously doubt a licensed DOCTOR did review this pre-authorization. It was probably some clerk in Human Services Dept. It's the doctor's responsibility to generate a reasonable (to standard of care) treatment plan. A "check off" by the Medicaid Office isn't an excuse for gross over-treatment, inappropriate treatment, abusive treatment, &/or treatment below minimal standards of care.
Dentist 2 Review of the charts
I reviewed the radiographs and the chart. (Of course, no clinical notes but that's okay.) This is what I noticed:
The patient was first seen at the very end of 2009, with private insurance. The radiographs from that time show some decay, but its not extensive.
Almost a year and a half later, the child comes in with more extensive decay, especially on the deciduous first molars (B, I, L, S) and the deciduous upper central incisors (E, F). Sometimes radiographs don't show the whole story, but its clear that there has been an increase in the size and amount of decay.
Having said that, I was a little surprised to see the extensive nature of the work shown in the last radiographs.
Something that bothered me was the pre-fab stainless steel crowns in general and especially the one on tooth A. The patient is a young child, those crowned teeth have to stay in his mouth for 5-7 more years before they normally exfoliate. The roots of the deciduous, or baby, teeth are still quite long.
It is highly unlikely that those crowned teeth will survive that long because there seem to be a lot of overhangs in those steel crowns. Something at some point will get lodged in there and cause problems. When this inevitably occurs, then extraction(s) will be done and a space maintainer made and billed out.(Those were the parts of the consent form that the patient's mother didn't initial, but the extractions and space maintainer will likely be coming up in the future.) After that, perhaps orthodontics.
Also, I am concerned about tooth A. There is no record of a pulpotomy done on tooth A. A stainless steel crown placed on a vital tooth is going to hurt if the nerve is still alive and vital. I would ask if the child has any persistent pain in his upper right, furthest back tooth.
Tooth E's pulpotomy fill looks a bit short from what I can tell from the copy of the radiograph. I would keep an eye out for any swelling or pain in the patient's top right central incisor.
Finally, is Mercy care a government or Medicaid based insurance? I have a feeling that Metlife would have raised issues with the $2000 one-day payday. Hope this helps.
Hi Deb,Here are Moses' O's pictures. The last one was taken three weeks after his abuse.
My daughter Kristina has been in contact with you regarding her son, whom I took to the dentist and was treated so horribly. Little did I know that they were going to be doing such unnecessary work on his teeth, that I would've just walked out of there. And, I trusted what the assistant was telling me and therefore, took their word.
Ohhhh, I was so mad and upset at myself for letting them do that to him!! His mouth and eyes were swollen SO bad, it was such a horrible sight to see your grandson in that situation. Kristina told me about calling the PPD and filing a report and wouldn't you know they did not do shit about that!! They told me it was a civil matter and they cannot file a report because it not a criminal matter.
So I contacted the officers supervisor and she in turn told me the same damn thing...What is wrong with these PD's that they cannot take you seriously about what is going on? I got so frustrated with her, because she wouldn't even let me finish my sentences and I just hung up on her.
She was very rude to begin with. So, I don't know what else to do with the PD now, since they are saying it is not a CRIMINAL MATTER!! Do I proceed with her supervisor now or contact the police chief?
I think Kristina contacted the Attorney General's office and I went and filed a complaint with the State Board of Dental Examiners. I haven't heard anything to this date. I don't know if anyone has ever even submitted such complaints to the Board. I sent an email to one of our local TV stations regarding this, but they never even responded back to me, so I sent another one to a different station, and hope they do air it. I sent them the website you created and hope they take it seriously.
What you need to know about Kids Dental Place
